• vineyardlabs a day ago

    Personally, I would not try to negotiate an onsite role into a remote one, not because I don't think it will work (though it probably won't), but because you don't really want to be the one remote exception in a primarily onsite team.

    The rest of the team will end up having to go out of their way to accommodate you, your accomplishments won't be as visible, and you'll be passed over for performance-based compensation and/or promotion.

    Though I guess that's fine if it's a job you plan to take for a year or whatever and move on.

    • muzani a day ago

      Convince them that it's more productive. Usually the problem is that it's unproductive for the manager, not the IC.

      Keep in mind that it's usually a culture thing. Programmers working from home makes sense, sometimes the janitors, security, chefs, CS want to work from home too, which makes less sense. Whenever I've done crunch time on weekends, the managers or more senior ones are always there too, even when they're doing nothing, sometimes all the way up to the CEO. A lot of office cultures seem to encourage this form of suffering together. This is also more likely where the staff is mostly offline e.g. Tesla or Amazon.

      So I see absolutely no reason to give up compensation for this - this might actually hurt your argument. One option is taking on a part time contract instead so they're not under the same benefits as the ones who are working from office.

      • GianFabien 2 days ago

        As a potential employee your friend needs to first consider what the potential employer wants.

        Your friend needs to demonstrate that they are an exceptional hire, only then does negotiations about compensation and working arrangements come into play.

        • mcflubbins 9 hours ago

          > for life reasons he would really appreciate a fully remote job

          To be fair, most people would.

          I negotiated to go remote after working at a company for a few years (this was pre-COVID and much less common.) I worked hard, went above and beyond and proved that I was a valuable employee and discussed the possibility with my boss. We did a phased approach: I'd be remote one day a week for a month, then two days the next month, etc until I was fully remove. After a few months of being fully remote and still being as productive (or I'd say even more productive) they let me do global remote.

          IMHO Working remotely is a privilege, you have to earn it and work hard to keep it.

          • marssaxman a day ago

            Wouldn't it make more sense to look for remote jobs already being offered and apply to them instead?

            • hiatus a day ago

              Go through the interview, get an offer, and then negotiate for remote. If you made it that far you have more bargaining power than trying for remote at the phone screen stage.

              • Suppafly a day ago

                >If you made it that far you have more bargaining power than trying for remote at the phone screen stage.

                Perhaps theoretically, but I don't really see this being a winning strategy, you're just going to waste everyone's time. If a company doesn't want to do remote, they aren't going to change their mind for you. There are all sorts of tax and logistical reasons to not have remote, and a place that isn't setup for any remote employees isn't going to go through the cost of setting it up for one easily replaceable person just because they interviewed well.

              • killingtime74 2 days ago

                You could apply to companies that are remote first like Atlassian or Discord or Gitlab

                • hehehheh 20 hours ago

                  Atlassian is remote first but not digital nomad friendly. If the life reason is travel you can do it but only X days a year.

                  • killingtime74 5 hours ago

                    X being 3 months. If you are nomading to somewhere within company legal footprint you can transfer there.

                • readyplayernull 21 hours ago

                  Simply ask whether remote or hybrid is an option. If hybrid, negotiate with manager later, sometimes they aren't strict and let you skip office.

                  • Suppafly a day ago

                    >Do you think prospective employers/hiring managers have fixed remote policies or is there flexibility if they're willing to give up some compensation?

                    Yes, no.

                    >Is there an approach that is better than just asking directly?

                    No.

                    • eawgewag a day ago

                      Can your friend focus on all-remote companies?

                      • gregjor 2 days ago

                        tl;dr No general rule. Competition for remote jobs higher than on-site jobs.

                        Remote rules vary by company and job. Some jobs advertise remote ok. Some you can ask to do remotely. Some companies have hard rules for working on-site all of the time or a few days a week.

                        More senior people and those with in-demand skills have more leverage. Freelancers often work remotely.

                        • methinksstuff a day ago

                          wait for the offer, then say on second thought can’t do it if it’s not remote.