« BackAirfoil (2024)ciechanow.skiSubmitted by brk 3 hours ago
  • random_duck 5 minutes ago

    I wish there was an infinite number of blogs that where this good.

    • Lwrless 3 hours ago
      • huqedato an hour ago

        That's the missing course for the first year of any Aerospace Engineering faculty.

        • underdeserver 3 hours ago

          Should be (2024).

          • MarleTangible 3 hours ago

            I was excited for a moment, and wondered why the RSS feed didn't work, but later realized that the article is from 2024.

          • colechristensen 2 hours ago

            Ok that's long, one top line thing people tend to miss in these flying explanations is that airfoil shape isn't about some special sauce generating lift. A flat plate generates any amount of lift you want just fine. Airfoil design is about the ratio of lift to drag most importantly and then several more complex effects but NOT just generating lift. (stall speed, performance near and above the speed of sound, laminar/turbulent flow in different situations, what you can fit inside the wing, etc)

            • ge96 43 minutes ago

              Was gonna say where is the debate of bernouli vs. AoA/pforce (p-factor), scatter blast shotgun hitting bottom of wing

              • Stevvo 2 hours ago

                Umm no, at zero degrees AoA as the first diagram on the page shows, a flat plate does not generate lift. But nobody actually questions that a flat shape can generate lift; we all made paper planes as a kid.

                • andrewla 38 minutes ago

                  But every airfoil has an equilibrium angle of attack (not always stable with velocity) where it generates zero lift. The chordal angle of attack is for convenience because it depends only on airfoil geometry and not ambient velocity, but it isn't a fundamental physical property of the airfoil.

                  If we treat the angle where zero lift is generated as the base angle for an airfoil, then all airfoils generate lift depending on their angle relative to that, including a flat plane. As the GP says, other properties are the dominant factor in airfoil geometry.

                  When introducing airfoils I think it is more useful to start from a plane than a traditional airfoil shape; the math and intuitions are much clearer from there.

                  • kqr an hour ago

                    Paper airplanes do not have barndoor wings, though. Most of them have stepped camber through the way they are folded.

                    It's not finished but I started writing this to clarify: https://entropicthoughts.com/paper-airplane-aerodynamic-stab...

                    Scroll down to "trim and angle of attack".

                    (I hope there's nothing embarrassing in there. It's an old, early draft.)

                    • wat10000 an hour ago

                      There are about a million places incorrectly "explaining" that airfoils create lift because the top path is longer and this means the air has to go faster. A flat plate would not create lift in that case. The fact that paper airplanes obviously can fly somehow never stops people from repeating this.

                      • colechristensen an hour ago

                        Uncambered airfoils also don't generate lift at zero degrees. What constitutes "0" for curved airfoils is convenience. You want lift, you put a flat plate on an angle, anything fancier is for Lift/Drag, Thrust/Weight, etc.

                    • greenavocado 3 hours ago

                      Where can I find more articles where things are explained in this manner?

                    • mellisacodes 2 hours ago

                      wait what? this is goood!

                      • moralestapia 3 hours ago

                        I was just thinking the other day about how AI will pretty soon be able to create this kind of explainers on everything quite quickly.

                        Amazing times!

                        • bayesnet 3 hours ago

                          It’s kind of sad IMO. Bartosz has made a ton of these super interesting and meticulously designed explainers. Something thrown together with AI is much more likely to be made by someone who doesn’t know what they’re talking about, and I’m worried that the sheer volume will crowd out actually quality content like this.

                          • hollowturtle 3 hours ago

                            Don't think so, and we should stop spread damaging narrative like this. I'd say it's already able to imitate this kind of explainers(badly) thanks to his training data. All the subtle teaching nuances, effort, know-how and visual creativity that people like Bartosz Ciechanowski put on this kind of work is not reproducible if not statistically imitating it

                            • dahauns 2 hours ago

                              And the usual corollary: Not just thanks to his training data, but because training data of that kind and for this kind of topic - still - exists.

                              • hollowturtle 2 hours ago

                                Exactly and him not publishing any new post in 2025 makes me wonder...

                            • jkubicek an hour ago

                              Good rule of thumb: it should take less time to consume content than it does to create it.

                              I don’t know how long it takes Ciechanowski to create these explainers, probably a few months? It shows and it’s well worth spending your time reading through his content meticulously.

                              How long does it take for an LLM to crap out an equivalent explainer? 60 seconds? You should be spending less time than that reading it.

                              • carlos-menezes 3 hours ago

                                Haven't people been saying this since 2023? Yet to see AI build this kind of stuff "quite quickly".

                                • estsauver 3 hours ago

                                  I think it's actually already there. It's definitely possible to make these sorts of explainers with something like a Claude Code, you just have to spend a fair amount of time making sure that it's actually doing what you expect it to do. I think the biggest danger with something like a Claude Code is that you get something that looks functionally correct but that the details are suddenly wrong on. I wrote a little bit about this on my blog for some of the places that I've done visualizations actually, and I think it's remarkably easy to iterate on them now.

                                  https://estsauver.com/blog/scaling-visualizations

                                  • moralestapia 2 hours ago

                                    Hey, that's a pretty great article! Thanks for sharing.

                                    (I hope you don't get downvoted by Chichanowski's fanboys. Sad to see people being against innovation, on this site of all places.)

                                    I think it's only a matter of time, AI history has been a cycle of "yeah, but it will never do this", then literal weeks later it does it, lol.

                                    We should think about how each part of the iteration cycle you describe can be improved. This is definitely a problem that can be solved!

                                  • _verandaguy 3 hours ago

                                    It's been said before, but this prediction isn't amazing, imo.

                                    I look forward to Bartosz's articles because they're rock-solid sources of information and the visualizations are both easy-to-understand and surprisingly light on performance. It's all shockingly digestible.

                                    Honestly, as popular science writing goes, this is art as far as I'm concerned, and art is best when it comes from a place of passion and conviction, something AI will never be able to reproduce.